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My summary (and the reasons for my discontent) of Obama's Presidency
greekboi wrote
at 7:45 PM, Wednesday May 18, 2011 EDT
Can someone PLEASE tell me what good Obama has done for this country since the start of his Presidency? You can write an essay or list bullets, either way is fine. I'm not sure you will be needing more than a sentence though.

Without further ado, here's my summary of Obama's Presidency (in no particular order of importance or chronology) :
-he's shown a lack of convictions/decisiveness (very diplomatically stated) that has been displayed through his failure to implement any of the changes he advocated in his campaign that made him such an attractive candidate
-->his health care reform is good in theory, but it is constitutionally offensive, and it won't work without tort reform (did i mention the bill was over 2000 pages long and didn't even begin to explain how the program would be implemented?)
-->he did not close Guantanamo Bay, nor did he investigate if any human rights abuses occurred during GWB's term
-->he did NOT end American involvement in the ongoing wars in the Middle East
-->he bombed Gaddafi's personal dwelling (where his family lives)
-->he dropped immigration reform
-->he dumped his energy policy
-->he is now caving in to the demands for increased oil drilling and less regulations, which is not only something that Liberals have historically been opposed to, but also can potentially endanger Americans while NOT dropping gasoline prices at all
-->he announced a new national policy this week in which he promises to reduce drug use by focusing on prevention and treatment YET the $10 BILLION of spending on interdiction and law enforcement out of his $15.5 BILLION dollar drug-control budget is a record high in terms of dollars and percentage
-->he showed an inability to react quickly to a major crisis - the massive oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico - yet the media coverage left him relatively unscathed (which is very interesting considering the amount of blame placed on Bush for the lack of cohesiveness surrounding Katrina)
-->he used the aforementioned major crisis to promote green energy (instead of cleaning it up, lol)
-->he created an "economic stimulus" plan (not to be confused with President Bush's "bailout") that he said would not allow unemployment to exceed 8%, although last month it reached 9% (A HISTORIC HIGH)

The only thing clear about Obama's agenda is his vision of increasing entitlement program benefits and paying for it through increased taxation of those providing the most value to society (the high income earners) and over-taxing corporations. This is a great policy, if you support socialism.

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neutraI wrote
at 12:25 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
montecarlo wrote
at 12:47 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
dead wrote:
"Let's face it; parents know whats better for their child then any Washington bureaucrat; just allow the parents freedom of choice and they will choose the best option for their child. Those of you with children will understand this."

i appreciate your idealistic perspective on parenting. and my limited worldview lines up with it: i want the best for my kids, and most of my friends want the same. but you must accept the fact that there are significant populations in america where the parents dont care as much about their kids success and see school as an amazing thing not because it educates their kids and gives them more opportunities, but because it gets the kids out of the house for 8 hours a day and allows the parents to not be parents for awhile.

there are a lot of bad parents out there. my wife always marvels that we're not allowed to drive a car in america till we are tested and approved of, yet anyone is allowed to have kids. the amount of responsibility in raising a kid is mindblowing.

no, im not saying we should regulate procreation.

i remember a scene in the freakonomics documentary where the author is talking about parents who are worried about which school their kid should go to, private, public, which county, etc, etc... and his answer is, hey, if the parent cares that much for their kid, it doesnt matter where the kid goes to school, because the fact that the parents care so much is such a strong influence on the kid that he will be successful regardless of where he goes for his education. was an interesting point, was glad my wife heard it.
MadHat_Sam wrote
at 1:55 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
@deadcode

Creating a streamlined system that allows for easy documentation and legal immigration or work papers if they don't want to become citizens is obviously what we both agree on. You want to secure the borders first, how?

I view the current numbers of illegals as a sunk cost, as a country we just need to eat that cost and stick these people in the same line as those that want to come legally, sure they should go to the back of the line if possible.

Creating an open and easy system of immigration is the first step.

As for the DC voucher program, yes it was working well for the students that were taking advantage of it, but if you look at the study done after 3 years you see some of the issues I am talking about that would make vouchers viable on a national level. Lack of accessibility for all students, lack of resources for special needs etc, http://ies.ed.gov/ncee/pubs/20094050/index.asp.

Creating a program that hurts public schools that are already failing and at the same times doesn't give the same or equal benefit to every student that is eligible for the program doesn't solve the problems facing our education system.

We need massive changes in our education system, yes the teacher unions are one of but not the only obstacle to these changes. Monte's post about parents would be another issue also if chase wants to chime in about how terrible the students would be another obstacle.
montecarlo wrote
at 2:01 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
chase is in vegas, so i hope we dont hear from him for awhile.
deadcode wrote
at 2:08 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
Monte: "but you must accept the fact that there are significant populations in america where the parents dont care as much about their kids success and see school as an amazing thing not because it educates their kids and gives them more opportunities, but because it gets the kids out of the house for 8 hours a day and allows the parents to not be parents for awhile."

Yes I definitely agree that there are negligent parents in America; we may disagree on the magnitude. But let's talk about something I think we may both agree on.

I think the issue of negligent parents should be solved by education, social ostracizing, and child abuse laws (where there is provable child abuse). The current approach is to violate the freedoms of the majority of "good" parents for the sake of protecting the minority of neglected children. This is a very harmful to society.

I use "good" parents in quotes; because remember; parenting is very much a fluid "science". Surely parent's should be given the freedom to experiment with alternative parenting styles so that future generations can progress via observing their successes and failures. This is the method of all progress.
deadcode wrote
at 2:22 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
SAM: "Creating a streamlined system that allows for easy documentation and legal immigration or work papers if they don't want to become citizens is obviously what we both agree on. You want to secure the borders first, how?"

Well I think we probably would agree on the methods of securing the border. Basically use the methods that various nations currently use for securing the border. I'd leave this up to the experts. At the moment there is no rational discussion on the topic because both parties use the Hispanic vote as a political football.

But I totally agree that making entry to the country trivial is the first step to stopping the illegal entry. Why sneak in someones house; when they invite you in.

As far as the already illegal immigrants; they can go through the open immigration entry (open front door) so they can be documented.

Keeping immigration closed and then giving illegals amnesty only creates a bigger incentive to violate the laws instead of being a "sucker" waiting on line.

It is a very dangerous thing to create laws that you don't intend to enforce. As a result all laws lose credibility.

As for the DC voucher system; take a look at my earlier examples from other states. In fact voucher systems are used amongst many other nations with success. Sure the DC voucher system has some flaws; but I think the flaws were fixable and scrapping the whole system was a tragedy. Just ask the parents who were effected; which has been widely publicized.

This is probably the point where I should disclose my ideal thoughts on education.

The government should not be teach our children. The government does not have your childrens best interest at heart.
deadcode wrote
at 3:18 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
@Monte

Btw; It probably is worth mentioning that the current system of paying people for having kids through tax write offs and entitlements is a huge cause of this issue.

Look no further then these laws when you see an uneducated poor single mother with 6 neglected kids. The mother is hold the kids hostage for a seemingly free ride.
deadcode wrote
at 3:51 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
Btw; for those of you reading this long lengthy discussion and are interested in some of the ideas I've been presenting. There is a candidate in the 2012 election cycle that agrees with almost everything I've been talking about in these threads.

I really do believe that liberals and conservatives have a lot in common. They are just driven apart on wedge issues in order to create a two party system that never actually changes anything.

Here is a few clips of Ron Paul on the Daily Show; after watching you will see just how much Libertarians have in common with democrats.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-june-4-2007/ron-paul

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CCEQtwIwAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fvideo%2Fvideo.php%3Fv%3D1045557116196&rct=j&q=jon%20stewart%20ron%20paul&ei=q83WTfbiNsXXgQfAyd2YBw&usg=AFQjCNE8Nv9iwy57vQXLtV__wOskVTJafQ&cad=rja

Jon Stewart defending Ron Paul on O'Reilly:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CCcQtwIwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DCW4EdVh4TeY&rct=j&q=jon%20stewart%20ron%20paul&ei=q83WTfbiNsXXgQfAyd2YBw&usg=AFQjCNGIo-4nCa-CrCydMgYXTf6AoRG-ng&cad=rja

At the end of the day; we all just want freedom to pursue happiness and a better life for our children. These should be the core tenants of a platform.
greekboi wrote
at 4:10 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
ohh i like this quote:
"the inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries"
-Winston Churchill
deadcode wrote
at 4:25 PM, Friday May 20, 2011 EDT
Ron Paul praising Jon Stewart; which I happen to agree with.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-YZueRAOR0
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