Forum
The No RC at 10k Petition
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JeremyS wrote
at 6:05 PM, Thursday April 24, 2008 EDT
Whereas there is a highly limited pool of players who play at the 10k tables, and whereas we all know each other and play with each other frequently, it stands to reason that RCs will build up, whether due to a random smattering of games that players win together or whether certain players have a tendency to support each other.
While it makes sense to use RCs to prevent collusion at lower stakes tables, because there is essentially an infinite supply of games at the lower tables, we the players of 10k games find that instead of a boon to prevent cheating, it is instead a detriment to the ability to play games. <Personal note> I personally do not have any RCs this month, but have watched 10k games unable to be played because of them. I have sat at games with 6 players and watch MadHat_Sam (known to all as a player I don't get on with particularly well) not be able to sit because vicsf is sitting, and eventually everyone just gives up and leaves. </Personal Note> We state now and for the record that I would prefer to play a 10k game with two players who win often together than not play a 10k game at all. We also state that clever players who wish to collude have already figured out easy ways around the RC calculations, that I will happily spell out to Ryan in private. Therefore, given the situation as it currently stands, we, the undersigned humbly request that the RC cheating prevention mechanism be lifted from all 10k and above tables until such time as there are sufficient players that 10k games become easy to start on a regular basis. |
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Holy Roller wrote
at 9:04 AM, Saturday April 26, 2008 EDT lol
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Rsquared wrote
at 11:33 AM, Sunday April 27, 2008 EDT I agree
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nexon wrote
at 5:16 PM, Sunday April 27, 2008 EDT my vote for it
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AMO wrote
at 4:21 PM, Monday April 28, 2008 EDT Disagree with Jeremy.
Totally agree with SAM. There are ppl who doesnt sit at 10K cause they know there is THE secret club house. ;) Look at our very criticised first player: Bombardier [im not defending him i hate that u have to play million games to be first (i love the ELO era)] he know he's not a member of the club so he plays his thousand games in lower tables knowing that there he has a chance, and he's proving it. The fact with RC is that will be cheated soon also. AMO |
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Holy Roller wrote
at 4:41 PM, Monday April 28, 2008 EDT I'm not convinced of there being a "club"
I started really playing this month and have gained more than I've lost at every level of table, including 10k. I am nice to other players at the tables I play on and I get respected in return. I don't pga and I don't know anyone outside of the game. I do find that talking to everyone in chat and playing a lot of games with them leads to them knowing how I play, and what I will do. This often means that I can pass on killing another 10k+ player early and they will be kind in return. It does not mean that new players can't come up to the top. I did it this month. I had played maybe 100 games total over 5 months prior to this month. Yes, most of the good players know each other. No it's not a conspiracy. There are limited people at the big tables. Of course if only 20 people have more than 10k I will get to know them all over the course of 30 games. RC is a problem because while some players may pga, it is more likely that some players sat at the same table for a series of games (like 10-15 in a row) and became friendly. I have seen this happen multiple times. This is just part of only having 20 people that can play 10k (or 2.5k earlier in the month). And sometimes RC occurs purely by accident, with no pga, or even idea of helping the other person. Just playing the same table and coincidence taking over. The problem then is that because of 2-3 RC's that are justly or unjustly earned we can never get a 10k game started. The people wanting to play don't care about the RC. Maybe instead of having an RC the game could announce: Beware, PlayerA and PlayerB may be PGA, you may wanted to counter ASAP! Then we could all play together and kill the RC'd people, and it would be great. Thanks, ~HR |
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yellowfin wrote
at 5:46 PM, Monday April 28, 2008 EDT No rc at 10k too hard to get games, and reality too many get rc'd because of limited pool of players at limited top tables = one hot streak makes rc
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MadHat_Sam wrote
at 7:55 PM, Monday April 28, 2008 EDT It is a club, the RC over time will make it less of a club, it isn't always nice, since I would like more 10k games but it is a club. The fact that there is the RC detector has caused some players to start playing there and more will come. Yes it isn't the greatest now, but give it a few mon ths and more and more people will be playing.
I am right about this. It is just like elo, 1900 was the clubhouse, then 2k. The top tables will always be the cool kids club, you need some implement to try to break down the notion that a new player cannot get a fair shake, this is what the RC does. Get over it and give it time. |
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jurgen wrote
at 3:57 AM, Tuesday April 29, 2008 EDT First of all, I agree with Sam, give it time and accept a few wrong RC detections to keep the real RC detecting active.
I also hope more and more players will consider playing a 10k game a bit more. Maybe some mandatory system might help as well. Players that maintain a score above 15k for 10 games should get a warning message like "Congratulations you are a very skilled player. I think it is time now for you to enjoy the exitements of the 10k table. You cannot play any extra games until you finish a game at the 10k table. Good luck". Playing at least 10% of your games at the top level table sounds fair to me. |
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Holy Roller wrote
at 2:17 PM, Tuesday April 29, 2008 EDT Re: "The top tables will always be the cool kids club, you need some implement to try to break down the notion that a new player cannot get a fair shake, this is what the RC does."
The top tables will always be where only the top players can play. That doesn't make it exclusive. It means that the same people will play together and get to know each other. Hopefully people will play up to the tables they are capable of more than once. I have seen people quit after 1 game because they lost a lot of points after a bad game. Or because they thought people were pga'd because they didn't say "I want an alliance" in chat. This will improve with experience and RC will have little/no effect on them. Again, of course people at the high table know each other, that is because they are good enough to consistently be at the highest table. When new people come in they aren't shunned, but they might need a few games to get the hang of the subtleties / become familiar with playing styles. |
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yellowfin wrote
at 9:52 PM, Tuesday April 29, 2008 EDT sam, we got rc'd last month. Tell me, have we ever, even once, been close to pga? Yet we couldnt play together. Hell I always understood that if given a choice between me, and almost any other regular you would go out of your way to attack me. One player not being able to sit at 10k is difference 75% of having a 10k or not.....
No more rc at 10k |
