Forum
Is Kdice a Social game?
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bcmatteagles wrote
at 4:43 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT
Apparently kdice isn't a social game according to Brubaker, this just makes me think about what makes a great kdice player. I'd say more then 60% of their skill is in mastery of the social aspects of the game. other thoughts?
*Brubaker*: matt - you are taking a leaf from the 'best' players bcmatteagles: what leaf is that ThunderLizard: im in a learning mode *Brubaker*: the 'best' players conned, conived and slimed their way to the top - that last game was a perfect example bcmatteagles: brubaker you are a fool, the game is a social game *Brubaker*: PLAY your OWN fucking GAME. bcmatteagles: it involves turning players against each other and making truces DRUNKYMASTER has left bcmatteagles: if yo uthink otherwise go play dicewars *Brubaker*: ah, I see *Brubaker*: well, I disagree. beepa: anyway, didnt want to be a "brainy" (?) bcmatteagles: you disagree that it's a social game? *Brubaker*: I think you can be good at this without the need for deception. bcmatteagles: the whole thing is social the whole thing is deciding who attacks who and why *Brubaker*: well now you've got a reason to attack me. tata. bcmatteagles: that is why you will be mediocre at best and less then average most likely *Brubaker*: 'mediocre.' bcmatteagles: at best *Brubaker*: mate I win games by tactical know-how *Brubaker*: something you 'people' lost a long time ago *Brubaker*: game tactics *Brubaker*: not lame-ass politics bcmatteagles: the truly great players like rnd, grun understand that it takes a combination of tactical expertise and social expertise *Brubaker*: 'social expertise' *Brubaker*: explain that to me. Malcolm2K has left Divercesc has left bcmatteagles: manipulating people to your favor and understanding when and how you can trust other players *Brubaker*: set up a table with 6 robot players, and 2 'great' players - see who wins. ThunderLizard: not too bad for killing myself bcmatteagles: the game doesnt have robots, it's people bcmatteagles: it's a social game ... *Brubaker*: no - the point is to play your own game and take pride in it - win, lose or draw. TommyR has left bcmatteagles: well i play to win bcmatteagles: because it's a game in which you try to out play and outwit opponents bcmatteagles: in order to win *Brubaker*: outwit yes, cheat, canive and twist, no. bcmatteagles: what do you mean cheat? *Brubaker*: that is exactly why chess players are not allowed to speak to each other. Al G has left tberkowsky: pink, want a truce? bcmatteagles: is this game chess? bcmatteagles: this is a social game *Brubaker*: if this little box was removed, the top 50 would cease to be. bcmatteagles: exactly, because it is social game - nitwit *Brubaker*: you would see the truly 'great' players bcmatteagles: you just proved my point bcmatteagles: the fact is the box DOES exist |
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lesplaydices wrote
at 5:01 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT This really pisses me off.
"tberkowsky: pink, want a truce? " It is pretty clearly red. I mean COME ON. Anyways, I think what Brubaker was getting at was that this SHOULDN'T be a social game not that it wasn't. Both "this isn't a social game" and "that it shouldn't be" k-ideologies are pretty dumb though. (imo). Also, Ithink Brubaker was confusing "socializing" with "politicizing". |
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*Brubaker* wrote
at 5:11 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT I think my standing on this particular issue has always been pretty clear.
1. Yes, it's a social game. 2. No, it's not about electioneering. Remove the chat box in November and see who wins. It won't be me, but I can assure you it wont be 90% of the 'top 25' either. Alright? |
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Ssergio wrote
at 5:18 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT I think you are both right, or maybe I just said that so you both would like me more.
Which would implie that I agree with bc, but that wouldn't matter cauz me being in the top 25/50 would mean to Brubaker that I 2 am a political, social rat that uses deceiving manupilation tricks to help me win games. Of course this is not true, for I am a knight in shining armour that only plays with great tactics. You dont even need dice to win if you are a strategic mastermind like me, Kasparov and Brubaker so why would we need "friends". Ban the box!!! ^_^ |
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dmb wrote
at 5:26 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT "I'd say more then 60% of their skill is in mastery of the social aspects of the game. other thoughts?"
Do you think this is still true with the newer versions of the game? I enjoyed the old kdice (pre-August) because it required a lot of diplomacy to do well, IMO. Now with such strong incentives to drop out and not fight there isn't nearly as much conversation (persuasion, truces, etc) as there was before. While the new system may have solved some of the PGA and ninja problems, I actually enjoyed identifying and combating those. It was a sort of game within the game which had an effect on your long term success. That's my two cents, anyway. |
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cheesewiz wrote
at 5:32 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT You guys just use the chatbox to save your ass. When you are about to die, you manipulate the person to go the othery way, or beg for a truce. Theres truly no skill in that.
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JKD wrote
at 5:56 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT If you don't like the chat box then play AI opponents such as Dice Wars?
If you don't want players to ally then use chatbox to counter them before it's too late. |
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*Brubaker* wrote
at 6:31 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT Ah yes, the old 'Stick to DiceWars' argument.
Well, if truth be told like most (if not all) players here, we like the 'multi-player' bit - that's not to say that DiceWars doesn't have it's place at the start of the month while waiting for the new tournament to begin. As it goes, I understand where Matt is coming from. He, along with many, many others here need the box. I, however, do not. If I win, I win, if I lose, I lose - but the result is based purely on luck and tactical skill (or lack of). Remove the box and you level the playing field. Only after this can you claim to be the true KDice champion. As I pointed out to Matt earlier, I'm aware of scores of players languishing in the basement who could give the 'greats' a run for their money. So why the worry? Remove the box, play the game and let's see who really is the goat. You're the best... right? |
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Big Jumblies wrote
at 6:53 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT That is what makes kdice so great, there is a lot more going on than whats on the board. Social skill plays a huge roll in the game.
That's why top players love it so much. I did horribly at the 2000 tables until people got to know me as a person. It's a lot of work to gain people's respect not only by the way you talk, but by your actions. The point is, it makes a 'war' game much more then men on a battlefield, in every war there are diplomats and strategists that play a huge roll in the outcome of the war. That's what makes kdice brilliant. It's not an idiot's game. |
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*Brubaker* wrote
at 7:11 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT "That is what makes kdice so great, there is a lot more going on than whats on the board."
Full points for pointing that out. Unfortunately, 90% of members don't know those who 'know' what's going on behind the scenes. "Social skill plays a huge roll in the game. That's why top players love it so much. I did horribly at the 2000 tables until people got to know me as a person." If this statement were true of any other competitive event, Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards would have won an Olympic gold medal, Tim Henman would be six-times Wimbledon champion and the USA would have won the FIFA World Cup since 1982. "It's a lot of work to gain people's respect not only by the way you talk, but by your actions." Really? Then how is it that you aren't so much feared on the boards as laughed at. Your 2nd place was a joke, plain and simple. That's why 'helicopters were not deployed.' You came 2nd by sucking so much RND dick it's any wonder you didn't get your stomach pumped sooner. "The point is, it makes a 'war' game much more then men on a battlefield, in every war there are diplomats and strategists that play a huge roll in the outcome of the war." Anyone who has ever been involved in war will tell you that politics and diplomacy are merely a pre-cursor to war itself, never a part. You speak of the symantics of combat, but have no understanding of it whatsoever. Nice avatar though. "That's what makes kdice brilliant. It's not an idiot's game." Finally, something we agree on. Not your attempt to justify PGA's, trucing, cheating or sliming your way to the top - the last bit. Idiot. |
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*Brubaker* wrote
at 7:15 PM, Tuesday October 2, 2007 EDT P.S - Ban the box for a month and I, along with a thousand other 'average' players here will kick your ass all over the board for a fucking giggle.
Alright? |
